|
Post by Mayberry on Sept 20, 2007 6:14:01 GMT -5
My thoughts are with you. Word of (unneeded) advice: please do whatever you need to do to take care of yourself in this. I honestly believe you have tried your hardest; I am so, so sorry that he has wasted your time and energy and, most importantly, the love you so obviously bear for him. What a crying shame. I expect today may be a real humdinger; and I will hold you in thought and prayer throughout the day. Wish I could give you a real hug.... {{{{{ISOpeace}}}}}}
|
|
|
Post by isopeace on Sept 20, 2007 7:41:55 GMT -5
A hug would be nice I'm going to try to not freak out today. I'm a little calmer. Didn't get much sleep, but that's ok. He already sensed the tension in my voice when he came home this am, and asked why I was mad. I said I wasn't, not wishing to get into anything at that moment. He said, yeah you are, but thankfully, he was too tired to persue it. A part of me wishes I was better at hiding my feelings. I don't WANT to call him on this one. If I do that, he'll know I'm watching him, and if he's going to do this, or worae, he'll just hide it better, which would mean the only other way he could do it is if it was a real person, or somewhere out of the house. I'd rather keep watching & seeing what he's going to do in the future..see if this was just a "these past few days" thing that he's not going to continue. But another part of me says that I should just accept that it does't matter the severity of his actions. They are wrong, and he's not showing that he will change, so the watching & waiting will just hurt me in the end anyway... My father always says something to the effect of how stupid people are when they keep doing the same things with the expectations of different results. I don't know what the next step is/should be. One voice says throw his (expletive) in the front yard..another voice says play it cool until I can survive without him. There is no S-anon group here. The guy that does the SA meetings h is supposed to go to asked him to ask me if I'd be willing to go if they started one. I said yes! Maybe I'll call the guy myself. I'm not sure I can trust h to relay how badly I want to participate.
|
|
|
Post by isopeace on Sept 20, 2007 13:22:00 GMT -5
Anger is going to make me sick. It is useless. It destroys happiness, peace & love. Let it go..just let it go.
|
|
|
Post by whoami on Sept 20, 2007 14:02:36 GMT -5
Isopeace, I am sending you a cyber hug too, and am so sorry for what you are going thru.
I don't know if you are familiar with ZT (Zerotolerance) who is a SO member of this board. WHen you mentioned you are considering playing it cool until you can survive without him, I couldn't help but think of ZT. I might be reading her wrong, but I think this is what she is doing too, basically. She seems very knowledgeable and maybe could help you out somewhat. Again, this is just a thought of mine I wanted to throw out.
I hope the possibility of a sanon group can be a tremendous help, I would call the guy!! Hoping the very best for you....
|
|
|
Post by Mayberry on Sept 23, 2007 6:49:23 GMT -5
How are you doing today? I'm thinking about you. Jinn
|
|
|
Post by isopeace on Sept 24, 2007 8:03:40 GMT -5
ughhh....i just began a rather long post, got about halfway through, hit preview, said..oh, that's not quite right, gotta change that, spelling error there...then I promptly x-ed out the window.... <sigh>
I'll come back later.
|
|
|
Post by isopeace on Sept 24, 2007 12:28:57 GMT -5
ok..how am I doing? Well...is it really that awful when someone who doesn't even know you says, god, you look like (expletive)..is everthing ok? Or....Have you been crying recently? You look so depressed. Yeah, thanks..no, I haven't cried in the last hour, but excuse me if you will, I need to go hide the tears that are beginning to ruin my makeup.
I'm exhasted. I haven't been sleeping well, getting maybe 5-6 hours at most a night. Since my teens, I've needed a solid 8 to function "normally".... so, I guess I'm a bit under-slept. I think a major part of it isn't physical though. I think most of it is an emotional wornout to the point of exhastion, which of course is just made worse by the actual physical tiredness. The combination of the two has left me a ticking time bomb of anger, resentment, sadness, fear & tears. I've managed avoiding detonation for the most part....except for a small pathetic episode yesterday where I actually allowed myself to believe he cared about how tired I was enough to see my tears, feel bad for me...oh, and maybe try to comfort me..what a joke.
I read a thread (i'm sorry I don't remember which one, I am so foggy today.) and in it was discussed boundaries, and where the final "line" was crossed for those of us who decide its time to go. I'm beginning to wonder where mine is. I keep setting the line, watching him cross it, then just moving it back a few feet, pretending it was never crossed..yet. So when will I run out of room to move backwards? When will I decide thats far enough? It wasn't when he told some woman he'd do anything to kill me. It wasn't when he practically stalked me the last time we split up. It wasn't when he brought p back into the house when I let him come home. It wasn't when he broke the latest set of promises. It wasn't after he belittled me for my body that birthed him 2 sons in 2 years. It wasn't after he spent hours discussing dirty "things" with other women. It wasn't after I discovered that he occasionally likes to wear women's underwear. It wasn't after he told me that I could never live without him, that I didn't care about my children & any judge would see that. So when will it be? Where is my final line? Am I ever going to find it? Or am I going to keep lying to myself?
For the last 4 nights, while I'm driving home from work, I've run over the same flat piece of metal in the same spot of the road. And everytime I did, I said, hope that didn't puncture my tire..I'll have to remember that's there tommorrow. It clicked in my brain last night that this is an example of my life. I keep running into the same issues (my ex was a crackhead who I waited 6 years for, hoping he'd "see the light", now I'm married to a PA/SA/Whatever he is today). I keep saying, ok, how much damage did that do I wonder? I really need to avoid that next time. Then I "forget" (avoid/deny?) that it's there, and next time around?? Yep, you guessed it..
I'm trying to figure out what I'm still doing here. I know for a fact I CAN NOT live without him financially. I have no idea how we'll survive if I make him leave. I'm afraid I'm living behind that fear. When he looks at me, I don't see love. I see hurt, anger & lies. Sadly, I don't often think of him as my husband. Most of the time, he's just the guy who lives here that has hurt me so badly & who I desperatly wish would love me. I feel like a pathetic little puppy....oh, please, love me, please... come to bed with me (I'm begging, wanting you to, but I don't want to force you, even though I'll feel as if I did if you do come). Listen to me when I tell you how I'm feeling. Care enough about me that you are actually SORRY for the hurt you've caused me. Care enough that you SHOW me how sorry you are.
It wasn't always this way. Our first date was a restaurant. Oddly enough, I now work for that company, just a different location. Anyway, we were sitting there, and he pointed out a couple sitting across the room. They had to be in thier 90's. You could just see the love..the way they held hands, the way they spoke to each other, everything about them screamed it. He said, I want that to be us 60 years from now. My heart soared. Noone had ever said they wanted me for 60 years, and noone had ever cared whether they had the "perfect love" with me before. A month or so ago, I was at work, and there was a couple celebrating thier 60th anniversary there. I took one peak out into the diningroom, just to see...it wasn't "my" old couple, but it was an equally in-love after all these years pair of old people who looked as if they wanted nothing more then to end thier days in each others arms. I had to walk away into the back of the kitchen to stop myself from losing it right then and there. They, in their beautiful moment, were just a reminder of how my dreams have been shattered. I was so happy for them and so sad for myself at the same time. I know that no "normal" healthy relationship is all roses & sunshine. I know marraige is work, hard work. All I want is the love that goes with all of that work. I want to know that my husband is proud of me, and I can be proud of him. I want to know that he BELIEVES (not just thinks for today) that I am the most beautiful person, inside & out, that he's ever known. I want to trust that he will love me, care for me & always be there for me. I want to feel safe trusting him. I want to be loved. I want to give all of these things back in return.
Anyway..I got sidetracked I guess. I think I'm just going to focus on what comes next. Or maybe I should say if I could figure out what that is, I'd be willing to focus on it..lol I have to laugh becuase that's basically how it is...I'm lost. I have no idea what my next moves should be. I think they should be to figure out finances, and how I can make it alone. But I know I can't, so I'm avoiding that internal conversation..
One more thing... I see through my little program that while playing his game the other night, he ran into the girl he had been talking to on the phone a few months back. He made no move to talk to her, but after he saw her, he did log into the character he has that she would recognize. I think this may have been his attempt at seeing if she would talk to him first...but I dunno..They didn't talk though, so I guess I should be happy, right? And then last night, I see that there was a conversation in the chat between a bunch of people (he wasn't involved in the chat) about some kinda questionable stuff..and someone mentioned a particular type of underwear. I saw that he started to private message the girl, but stopped himself and moved on with just a little "lol" in the chat. So, again, he controlled himself. I should be happy right? Then why AREN'T I? I *think* it's because I wish he would tell me these things happened, and what he did in response to them. I wish he'd have that level of "openness" to him...I don't think he ever will.
I'm trying to figure how to let go of the hope. How do you force yourself to let go of a dream when you just *know* that dream will never come true, that odds are you're going to lose yourself in pursuit of said dream? How do you just let go of hope when half of you is fighting to keep it?
I'm off to take a nap with the boys. Perhaps a little sleep will help, even though sleep is one thing you can't ever cach up on.
|
|
|
Post by isopeace on Sept 25, 2007 8:09:06 GMT -5
So I've made a decision...a small one, but one that leaves me feeling a tad bit better about me. I'm slowly realizing the ways I set myself up for failure, for pain & disappointment. Anyway, I've decided to stop expecting my h to be a h. I'm going to stop asking him to do things for me that I feel a husband "should" do for a wife. I'm going to stop expecting husbandly things from him. This includes, but isn't limited to... -Coming to bed with me -Comforting me when I'm upset, sad, angry -Asking how my day went -Bringing me home little "treats" as he used to do on occasion -Saying good night to me when he does crawl into bed and sees I'm still awake -Beginning discussions about our relationship, or lack thereof -Trying to earn my trust back -Being honest with me about every thing every time -Checking in with me if he's going to be late from work
I'm going to stop -saying "I'm going to bed" on my way to bed, as this was always a hidden message of "come to bed with me or I'm gonna be angry" Instead, I'll just say "good night" and walk away, NOT execting anything in reply. -asking him to do anything that directly benefits only me, such as getting me a drink, rubbing lotion on my back, etc. -starting conversations about his "addiction", his "recovery" or our relationship. -relying on him for my emotional fufilment -wishing he was different -thinking that he finally understands me -telling myself that I *need* him -feeling guilty for finally seeing that he is NOT, possibly never will be, the husband he told me he would be, and not knowing what to do with that realization. -thinking of myself as "alone". I have 4 children who need me, love me. I have family. I am NOT alone, even if there's noone holding me at night. -expecting him to put my feelings/needs/desires before his own -being angry when he doesn't fufill his role as a H -defining who I am through his perception of me
This is very difficult for me. I'm fighting with myself not to erase what I just typed and forget I ever had this idea..lol I'm not sure that these kinds of things will end up being healthy for our marraige, but I'm at a point where I don't think it matters right now. We have very little left in that marraige, and really, there isn't much more damage that can be done that hasn't already been done. The only good that could come out of these ideas is that I will no longer be crushed, disappointed or annoyed when he fails to do these things. If I don't ask/expect, then I won't be hurt, right? Well, that's the goal anyway... not to let his actions/non-actions affect me in a negative way anymore.
|
|
|
Post by isopeace on Sept 25, 2007 10:50:16 GMT -5
So I just had my first dose of applying my previous post to my life in real time...and it sucked.
His first SA meeting is today..I *thought* at 11 am. So, at 9:45, he's still sleeping (grrrr at the choice to sleep in & my jealousy over his ability to make that choice.) Because I haven't yet told him that I'm no longer going to be his alarm clock, I wake him up. "It's almost 10, you might wanna get up soon". He gets up a few minutes later, says nothing to me, but greets the boys with a wonderful show of affection (insert first pang of anger..why can't he be that happy to see me in the am?? Then rememberance of what I said I wasn't going to do...) I asked him to call & pay the mortgage, since the money's in his bank, he grumbled, so I did it. I notice its 10:40, and he's not even dressed. I contemplated saying something, and did.."What time is your meeting?" "12 to 1" "Oh, I thought it was at 11" "Nope." Then he showered, played with the boys, then left, after giving hugs & kisses to them (they are sitting on my lap at the time)...and without saying a word to me. Not a goodbye, shove it, to hell with ya, wish me luck, nothin'. And I felt it..the instant the door closed & I realized he just left without so much as a word to me, I got so angry. I know its a mask for pain, because I wish he'd acknowledge me by saying goodbye, and the fact that he didn't hurts. Then (about 10 sec later) I said, no..I'm not going to let this bother me. It's ok..I don't need him to say goodbye. I'm not going to let it anger me & fester.
But I'll tell ya, it's hard. I want to get to the point where I don't have to "talk myself into" feeling ok with life as I descibed it above. I don't know how to get there. I'm hoping I can train myself to just do it automatically. But then I think that what I will have become is a person who has shut off her feelings & buried them. That isn't healthy either. I don't want to be cold, uncaring. I'm guessing theres a fine line somewhere that I need to find.
|
|
|
Post by isopeace on Sept 25, 2007 12:46:36 GMT -5
So, he just came home for lunch before work..I didn't realize he was here, and turned the bathroom light off..he was in there, said, hey! Scared the hell outta me.. then he's like, that was rude! <biting my tongue>
THen he put a silver chip (sobriety chip I guess..didn't really look at it) on the computer desk before he left, and showed me some paper with some peoples phone numbers on it. He said it was so I'd believe he went & didn't skip out on the meeting..
Nice guesture I guess. Too bad I'm so mistrusting & angry over our past that I really don't care what proof he has. I never questioned whether he went..wasn't going to question whether he went. I guess he's used to me questioning everything, so it's a valid effort on his part...I wish I could see past my own feelings and actually *feel* happy that he's attempting to try, or at least acting like he's trying. Perhaps that what it is...because I don't believe he's really in this for the long recovery haul, I'm skepical over anything/everything... I feel bad for him right now.
|
|
|
Post by isopeace on Sept 25, 2007 17:13:22 GMT -5
After thinking about everything that I've written today, I came to the conclusion that I need to write a letter to my h. I need to try to calmly explain to him the things I'm thinking. I know that if I just begin these "withdrawls" he's going to say that I don't care about him, that I'm ignoring him, not acknowledging his efforts as he makes them. I feel like I need to explain to him that it really isn't about him, it's about me, protecting me from the hurt of his actions/non-actions. I think it would be best to write this instead of speaking it, as we both have a tendancy to over react in "conversations" and not be able to hear what the person is saying for what it is. I'm going to work on this tomight, since he is working late and I'll have a few hours after the kids go to bed to think my words through.
|
|
|
Post by isopeace on Sept 26, 2007 11:21:25 GMT -5
Ok, I don't really give a flying rats arse who reads this. I'm going to make no attempt at being nice since this is MY journal...don't read it if you don't like it.
Why would you so openly belittle & shame someone who's in the shoes you've been in? If you know how much p & mb hurts, why would you trample on someone for asking for help in dealing with it? Just for asking questions? It's kind of like a girl, 15, making [trigger]sexual advances towards a boy, then changing her mind & ending up raped.[/trigger] What should people say to her? Oh, well, you asked for it..duh! We don't have a clue why you'd feel violated. You should have made the responsible choices before it went that far... Gag me! I've been there. I don't give a (expletive) what choices I made, it gave him no right. And just becuase this poor woman made a really big mistake (one that I too have made...guess I should leave the board now, huh?) & a really bad judgement call DOES NOT mean she isn't deserving of help understanding & getting herself out of the situation she now finds herself in. Is there no such thing as compassion for people who make dumb choices? People who take chances? Have you never made mistakes? Never been irresponsible? Ever regretted something & needed to confide in someone, anyone, praying they might be able to shed some light on the very dark world you are living in at the moment?
Ok..I'll shut up now, but man, oh man, I am riled up.
|
|
|
Post by isopeace on Sept 27, 2007 9:11:43 GMT -5
He read my letter last night. He wrote a letter back. He wasn't angry. He wanted to know what steps I was going to make to heal, to address my issues. He said he wanted more time with me, less time with the computer. That he was sorry for all the pain he has caused me in our life together. Then he started a conversation with me about it. I can't remember now what question he used to begin, but he started a conversation. It was very refreshing. We talked about my anger being a mask for pain, much like I believe (and told him so) that his addiction is a mask for his own pain. He talked briefly about things he felt going to his first meeting. I told him I was proud of that step. He started opening up about his fears of never being able to control his thoughts. There were things that he said that angered me (becuase I took them as denial, not things a person who truley wanted recovery would say, etc) but I was able to let go of the anger and try to "hear" him, be patient with him as he tries to figure out his demons. I will admit that some of the things he said hurt like hell, especially when he started giving me tiny glimpses into his thoughts and his reactions to them. But somehow I was able to put that hurt away for another day. I explained some of the things & reasons behind the things I wrote in my letter, and he seemed to "get it", said he didn't want me to detach, that it felt like the first step of me "moving on". But he said that he understood why I felt I couldn't trust him, why I need to protect myself from the blow of future things, especially since he admits (and reminded me of it last night) that he can't tell me 100% he will never do these things again. All in all, the first 2 hours of that conversation felt like the beginning of healing, like a bridge was beginning to be rebuilt. Then it went to hell... Somehow the subject of the game coming up, I'm not sure how. I said, since we are on the subject, can I ask you a question? (here's one of the times I broke my boundaries..already..sigh) I asked him if since the last episode (him chatting with those women) if he had done anything wrong, inaproproiate, etc in the game. (I already knew the answer...was testing his ability to be honest..something I said I wasn't going to do. Man, it's hard to stick to what I say sometimes..) He hemmed & hawed, so I rephrased. Have you done anything that would be considered you acting out your addiction? (I didn't word it that way, but it was pretty clear what I was asking) He made quite a show out of it. He said no, then when I said are you sure, he did the whole "lemme think" face, "well not that I remember, I need to try to think about what you could be possibly talking about becuase I thought I had been good. No, I haven't done anything at all.." I told him that he had just destroyed the fact that the conversation until that point had felt very trusting, safe & open. I went out to smoke and think. When I came back, I decided to tell him what I already knew, for a few different reasons.
I told him I still have the keylogger on the computer. I told him that it was up to him if I kept it off or deleted it...that I would delete it right in front of him if he wanted me to. I told him how it has become an obsession to me to HAVE to know what he's doing every minute I'm not with him. I told him I didn't like the panic I felt the other day when I couldn't account for 1.5 hours of his time through the logger. I told him that I no longer wanted to check up on him. If he decided he wanted some kind of accountability software to help himself & to help regain my trust, that was fine, but I didn't want it to be a secret anymore. He said "do whatever you want to do". So, today, when he gets up, I'm going to delete it. I want him to say he WANTS me to have it, not that he will tolerate it being there.
Then I told him I knew he ran into A*** in the game the other day. (This is the first time I guess that he realized that I had screenshots, not just keystroke records..) I told him exactly how I felt..that I was glad he didn't talk to her, but upset becuase I felt he wanted her to start talking to him first. He confirmed that was what he was hoping...said he was going to talk to her, but decided against it (mostly because he was suspicious I still had the keylogger)
Then I told him I knew about the other day when he started to private message the girl (who was having a "racy" discussion in the general chat of the game.). Again, I told him I was angry (hurt) that he thought the conversation funny, I was angry (hurt)that he even thought about taking the conversation to a private level with her, but that I was proud of him that he stopped himself. (now, in retrospect, I've lost a bit of that pride in him, becuase it feels like it was fake..he only didn't talk to her becuase he was worried about getting caught..but at the time, I was very proud of him, and I told him so.)
Then I said, now that you know I have screenshots, is there anything else you'd like to "remember".. he said, yeah, that one half naked girl toon sitting on the ground...but thats it. I told him I knew that wasn't it, but he maintans thats all he remembers..so, whatever. He will not admit that originally telling me that he hadn't done anything in the game, that he didnt remember doing anything, etc was lying. Even after he admited that he thought about that one girl toon situation as soon as I asked the question, and still answered with a "no, nothing.." How can you admit to remembering, yet not admit you are lying when you said you didnt remember?
It ended with me telling him I felt unsafe finishing the conversation because he wasn't being honest and I was getting angry. Then he said he was sorry for lying to me. Then a little while later, somehow he "talked" me into s_x. I tried to tell myself it was a way of connecting and that was ok. this am I don't feel that way. I feel used. I feel like I allowed myself to forget about everything I said I was going to do, in the conversation, in the s_x, in everything I did last night. So I'm disappointed in me. I'm trying to not be disappointed in him, as that would imply I have expectations that he failed to live up to, In reality I do, and he did. I don't think the "boundaries' I wrote are even doable. I think I was just lying to myself, trying to make myself think I'm farther ahead in my understanding of all this then I really am. I'm not strong enough to turn off my feelings, needs & wants. I'm not strong enough to not care about what he does or doesn't do. I'm just not strong enough, period.
|
|
|
Post by isopeace on Sept 28, 2007 7:52:41 GMT -5
The desicion regarding the keylogger was made. It's staying on the computer, and at his request, being put on the other computer as well. He says he's been tempted to use the other computer, knowing "for sure" I didn't monitor that one, but that so far, he hasn't given in to that temptaation. Not sure I believe this, but it doesn't really matter at this point. He said it will be easier for him to resist temptaion if he knows I can easily catch him on either computer. He also said that if he did slip, having proof would be helpful becuase he seems to "forget" that he slipped once a few days go by. I'm not sure how I feel about this statement. It seems very cop-outish to me, but I'm not going to over analyze. Also, I forgot to add that during the "safe" half of our conversation the other night, he told me he had called the cable company to get a channel removed. It was actually a move I meant to make a month or so ago. HBO on demand has very pornographic "specials" (they have the nerve to refer to one of them as a documentary...gag) you can watch for free. I ran into it by accident before (and now I know he did too) and I had every intention of calling the cable people to get it blocked, just for whatever reason, never did. I'm glad now that I didn't, because that meant he could. The fact that he did is a plus in his favor in my mind, a small step down the long road he needs to travel. He says he was very tempted to watch the show about strippers, that he did watch the preview (I know this was unavoidable...it comes on as soon as you get to that channel), but that he changed the channel before he allowed himself to watch the show. Again, I'm not sure I believe this is true, but I don't think it's important at this point. Yes, honestly is VERY important, but I already know he's slipped very recently in one way or another, so it's not a huge difference if he did watch it, IMO. If I found out he did, I would just be very angry that he told me he didn't. I honestly don't think I'd be that suprised or even angry that he watched it, if that makes sense at all.
As far as the keylogger..Its wierd becuase now that he knows its there, I have less of an urge to check it. For example, it's usually the first thing I do every morning once the kids are off to school. I've been on the computer for about an hour now, and haven't checked it yet. I want to, but it's not at the "panic setting in if I don't" stage. I think I need to limit myself how often I do check it, amybe once every few days would be good to start, then gradually less. I just know that I can't continue letting it drive me everyday the way it was.
|
|
|
Post by isopeace on Sept 28, 2007 8:10:21 GMT -5
As an uplifting sidenote..my youngest began walking for real yesterday. It's so refreshing to watch him take little steps, fall down, and get back up. That's what this is all about...baby steps, right?
|
|