My wife's shaming

[SouthernGuy]

All,

Last night my wife pulled out the shame tool on me. It had nothing to do with p, just support that she expected that I didn't provide. Now, I don't claim to be the best person in the world, and I certainly could be more considerate of her needs. But, it would have been better if she had discussed her feelings rather than resorting to shame. I've learned the difference between shame and guilt and have tried to let go of the shame whenever I start feeling it. This time though, I'm finding it difficult to deal with the shame that she dumped on me last night. I haven't acted out or anything, but today has started out pretty hard.

Sorry for whining, but it's good to get it off my chest.

SG

[breakingfree]

Last night my wife pulled out the shame tool on me. It had nothing to do with p, just support that she expected that I didn't provide

IMO, if you are an addict and discussing relatonship issues IT ALL HAS TO DO WITH P***.

bf

[kianna]

I haven't acted out or anything, but today has started out pretty hard.

P is not a comfort/coping tool.

[SouthernGuy]

breakingfree: I'm a bit confused here. Are you saying that the only problem that I have in my relationship with my wife is the addiction? That I am otherwise a perfect, model husband? Or said differently, if I did not actually have an addiction I would be perfect? I simply don't believe it. I didn't exhibit addictive behaviors before we were married more than 14 years ago but I still wasn't a perfect husband then.

Kianna, thanks for your reminder. I guess I'm just feeling a bit down right now, but I'll be OK. Thanks again.

SG

[mo4wo1]

Glad to see you recognize this:
"Now, I don't claim to be the best person in the world, and I certainly could be more considerate of her needs."

Are you certain she could have informed you of this in a more constructive manor or is your guilt possibly convincing you of her "wrong way" to help you feel less guilty?

[SouthernGuy]

Perhaps it's just a sign of my blindness, but I think so. My wife was a bit liberal with the "shame" last night with me as well as the kids (we have 6). A couple of them went to bed crying. My kids certainly don't have this addiction (I hope and pray that they never do!!) but the shame was there nevertheless. Please don't think that I don't recognize that I need to be a better husband, it's just hard for me to correct my behavior when I feel ashamed rather than guilty.

BTW, I consider shame as a feeling of worthlessness (I've done wrong and so I must be an inherently bad person) and guilt as a recognition that I've done wrong and a determination to correct it.

SG

[Curious Voyager]

southernguy said:

BTW, I consider shame as a feeling of worthlessness (I've done wrong and so I must be an inherently bad person) and guilt as a recognition that I've done wrong and a determination to correct it.

SG

This is how I feel this morning. Wife and I had group and it didn't go well. But like I told her "I took offense to what she said. That wasn't what she was giving but what I took. I can see your case might be different and my reaction was taken by her as offense.

Like I told her, this is about recovery and she is a dynamic part of my life and that includes addiction. When she said to me that She didn't see how I could ever be a group leader if my feelings were that easy to hurt. I said to her--you and I have a history, the dynamics between us are different.

I think yes, SouthernGuy, that on some level how you are feeling and dealing with the feeling is linked to your addiction and or addictive tendencies. AND Like Carnes says our co-addicts have also learned behaviors in response to our addictions that have to be worked through.

Recovery does NOT and cannot occur in isolation. Your wife undoubtedly has issues to work through as well. Addiction IS a family dynamic and so too recovery must be.

Be gentle with your Self and with her as well. This way lies happiness.

[Three Legged Dog]

Dude,
Women vent. It's there prerogative, along with a bunch of other unpleasant behaviors usually related to hormonal issues.

A general venting on the whole family should indicate it wasn't just you, and that should help alleviate the shame.

You may be wasting your time trying to get to the root of the problem but you should try. Other than that, do something extra nice, a.k.a. housework. Forgive her and yourself, abandon all hope of revenge, and move on.

One thing you should insist on: Have her talk with the kids.

The best response to shame is guilt. If she shamed you, guilt her. Get all the kids involved and do something really special, that'll teach her. ;D

[SouthernGuy]

CV, after reading your post I find my hand moving uncontrollably to my chin in a pose much like the gorilla on your picture. Thanks for the comments, I'm certainly thinking.

ThreeLeggedDog, you're absolutely right! maybe I should just relax and let her vent this time. I just felt like venting myself and figured this was a better place to do so than at home.

[mo4wo1]

ThreeLeggedDog,

I truly hope you are not blaming a woman's feelings on hormones. Men have them too. Same ones, even! Different levels, usually. But when I read & hear comments like this or similar in meaning -- "It's her hormones!" -- they tend to follow such statements of how the woman was aggravated about something the man did or didn't do. In other words, it's a seriously huge & old example of "blame shifting". Being a woman & one that has "hormone issues", at the most, my hormones only affect how willing I am to tolerate things. I am never mad because I am hormonal. I just tend to not hold back & "play nice" or be a "good girl" when someone agrivates me.

And if the "whole family" is upset by one member's behaviors, that member should honestly reconsider their behavior.

SouthernGuy,

I see your definition. Is your wife saying you have no recourse, no way back from what it was you did, that this is something that will never change in you? You can always ask her to express why she feels this way, even if she's done it before & you feel you know why... and she feels she knows you know why or should by now.

WRT the kids, why were they involved?

And we just have 4 kiddos.

[breakingfree]

breakingfree: I'm a bit confused here. Are you saying that the only problem that I have in my relationship with my wife is the addiction? That I am otherwise a perfect, model husband? Or said differently, if I did not actually have an addiction I would be perfect? I

Either you totally missed my point or I did I poor job of stating it.

IMO, WORK YOUR RECOVERY FIRST. IF YOU AREN'T SOBER, DONT STAY SOBER

THERE IS NO RELATIONSHIP TO WORK ON

I have been married for 22 years I KNOW I have relationship issues. But I am only going into my third month of sobriety, If I seriously f*** up I WILL NOT HAVE A MARRIAGE ANYMORE. Those are my boundaries. Yes, Mrs. BF and I are working on marital issues, but I am finding many of these to be self-resolving as my head clears with increasing sobriety.

IMO..

bf

[Three Legged Dog]

To mo4wo1,

I don't want to hijack SouhernGuy's post here but would like to respond to you concerns.

The term 'vent' implies letting off steam and the pressure had to come from somewhere. Of course there were real issues leading to the venting. What I was trying to get at was women people will hold things in and hormones can play a part in triggering a vent event. I had a feeling I didn't say it right as soon as I posted.

At least in my wife's case, she is sometimes so upset that even she can't articulate the root problem. It helps to just do something nice for her, then later we may get down to the real cause. Sometimes the real cause is that I haven't done anything nice for her lately.

[mo4wo1]

I get about the venting. It was just the way your post implied it was due to hormones that she needed to vent, not that another person's behaviors gave her cause to vent.

[SouthernGuy]

Mo4wo1,

I took Three Legged Dog's remarks in the context of his later explanation, i.e., my wife had trouble articulating her frustration that she felt from all of us last night. As far as the kids are concerned, I think that my wife felt that she was the only person in the family that was trying to pull off a particular family activity (we were going to look at Christmas lights). The rest of us were not trying hard enough to make it happen in her opinion -- hence the kids were included in the frustration as they were the dominant reason we were unable to do it. As I said to breakingfree, this problem doesn't really seem related to addiction, just inattention I guess.

The frustration that I felt last night and this morning stems from words said in the heat of the moment. I think she feels a bit better now than she did then. I will work harder at helping the family do the things that she wants us to do, and I will help the kids understand that desire as well. This is not a threat to our marriage, just a bad night I think.

breakingfree, I see your meaning now. Maybe the addiction played a part afterall....

Let me give you a little background on my situation: My family and I recently moved across the country (like 2,500 miles). We now live about 2,100 miles away from my wife's parents. My wife's parents are both in very poor health (dad has cancer and sleeps all the time, mom has her own set of problems) and it really bothers my wife that she can't be there to help. It's Cristmas time (you know all of the stress associated with that!), we now live in the south eastern US and the weather's different, language is different, bugs are different, etc, etc, ..... We have lived here about 4 months and I think the adjustment has hit one of those moments that she's just having trouble handling right now. I think we'll make it through it OK, but it will be a bit bumpy for a while.

Sorry for the lengthy response, but it's nice to get it out.

SG

[mo4wo1]

Southernguy,

Okay. I am glad you got his point. I still don't get why hormones were mentioned. Point could have been made without it by saying just what you said (and please pardon my slang), "(your) wife had trouble articulating her frustration that she felt from all of (y'all) last night".

WRT the kids, okay. I get it now.

Hopefully she will realize her words were not necessary & apologize genuinely, if she hasn't already.

Best wishes.