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Post by notsoserene on Dec 14, 2007 10:12:56 GMT -5
I am thankful for a place to go and explain how I feel. For so long I felt I wasn't allowed to feel this way. I was told it was wrong and I was the one who had to change. This subject has made me cry more than any other thing in the world. Made me loose countless hours of sleep and completely devastated my self esteem.
I met my spouse on line when I was 16 years old and he was about 22. I was so young and naive. My family was torn apart and I was alone and needed something or someone and along he came. I had no clue at first that he was addicted to porn and had to watch it every moment of the day. Actually it wasn't until I had my 2nd child. I was in the hospital after having my son and we didn't have a babysitter so he had to take our daughter home after visiting hours. So after he got home I kept trying to call...I was alone in a hospital room after having his child and after almost dying with my first child I was curious as to why the phone was busy. I stayed up all night. When I got home and saw that he spent every moment he was home on the computer watching porn I was shocked. The perverse, nasty things I had to see were unthinkable. I cant even categorize it as porn!
He has spent the past few years sneaking away and downloading and watching porn while I raise our 2 children. Let me clarify it is not the porn I mind, as a healthy dose of sexuality is always good. It is the amount and how important it is to him and how worthless he makes me feel intentionally. I am not your typical house wife. While I do stay home and take care of the children and clean our house, I am also a smoking hot redhead. Recently after having my 2 children I started modeling. I was hoping maybe it would make him see me as beautiful for once. Or raise my self esteem to a healthy level. I have asked him to quit and told him how it hurts so bad that I am not good enough. All he says is give me more sex than I will quit but he never does. It is hard to give myself physically to him when I don't know if when we are having sex he is thinking of other women. When he touches me I feel nasty. I feel that he would rather please himself. That a girl on a computer can do it better for him than I can. It makes me feel inadequate (spelling) about myself. The worst part is after 7 years I am at a point of giving up. He told me if i left him he would take my children. And like I said before my family was torn apart and I watched my mother loose 7 children. Loosing my children is not an option. I cant leave them with such a sicko. Whats worse is his parents have the money to back it. He has made me get rid of all my friends and any remaining family I used to talk to. I literally sit at home 24 hours 7 days a week (unless I have to work which is a few hours 1 weekend a month). I don't have a license because I was only 16 when we met and in the custody of the state. So I had to wait until I was 18 and after that he just prevented me from getting it. Always talking about how bad women drivers are and how I will fail. He is in charge of all the money. When I do a photo shoot and make a few hundred he takes it from me. I have to ask him, like I am a child, if i need something and he will decide if I can have it.
Every night he plays with himself in bed. or he sneaks out of bed and lays on the floor. I cant understand why he cant use that energy on me. It is uncomfortable laying in bed next to a man that masturbates every night. What is a woman to do. I have so many emotions and incidents that cannot even be conveyed. This has caused some serious emotional issues. For the holidays........ my one wish......... if I could have anything in the world, It would be to have a man that only has eyes for me. A man that compliments me, who cares how I feel, Respects me, someone who doesn't try to hurt me every Chance they get.
I was sad to see so many other women going through the same problems. I browsed some of the stories on this and other sites before I was in tears seeing how similar they were to my own life. I was inspired to unload some of my own emotions. Thank you for taking the time to read it.
Not So Serene
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shanti
Junior Member
Posts: 60
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Post by shanti on Dec 14, 2007 10:50:28 GMT -5
(((((Not So Serene)))))) I am so sorry you have found yourself in this difficult place. I read what you wrote and my heart goes out to you. I'm sure you will get lots of good advice on this board and you will find a way out of this. No parents or law courts could want to enforce this state of affairs. I wonder if there's a hotline to a local women's shelter or something like that, that could give you some ideas about how to start freeing yourself and your children from your husband's tyranny. But mainly I just wanted to write back right away and tell you I read what you wrote, I'm here, we're here, you're not alone!!! Thank goodness you are finding ways to reach out. You deserve a better life and you will get it.
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milla
Full Member
Posts: 170
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Post by milla on Dec 14, 2007 12:04:28 GMT -5
I'm hoping someone with more knowledge will respond to this post, but for now I'll just say you're clearly in an abusive relationship and should seek the services of your local women's shelter on how to extricate and find legal counselling. They should know how to get you on track.
Don't believe what he says at this point. He's proven himself to be a liar already so saying he's going to take your kids is just more bs he's throwing out to scare you out of doing anything about leaving. Sure he may try and fight, but you've got more on your side. Again, you need to speak with a lawyer about your options.
I understand you don't want to break up your family, but he's controlling your life to an extreme degree and people like that are usually not that amenable to changing.
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Post by LookingUp on Dec 14, 2007 12:33:20 GMT -5
Let me clarify it is not the porn I mind, as a healthy dose of sexuality is always good. Porn addiction is NOT about sex. It is a way to get a brain-chemical high. Then they get addicted to that chemical so they can't stop porning and mb. It has more in common with a heroin addiction then it has in common with sex. I think many of the PAs have chosen beautiful women. Several here have been models. He probably thinks of porn/mb as a type of sex. In that "sex", he doesn't have to do foreplay, he doesn't have to please her, he can turn off the monitor at any time, he can do anything he wants - and he isn't expected to take out the garbage, give the baby a bottle or snuggle and be nice after sex. It becomes all about him. Then they start thinking the porn women are better because they make no demands. ZT says they loose their hetrosexual for pornosexuality. You can do that no matter what he decides. That's normal. If you'd ask him - he probably thinks he has... they don't think right when they're in their addictive fog. That's normal to feel that way. That's why we have an in-house separation when my husband has a slip. It gives me time to heal. I also insist we have a light on and he makes eye contact. Then if he zones out, I know it and I can leave the room. I won't be his blow-up doll. You might check with a lawyer. Some PA fathers are required to have supervised visitation to see their children. Courts are slowly starting to recognize how devestating PA is to children. A good lawyer could give you ideas on what you'd need to get that provision. Have you considered changing that dynamic now that you're an adult? That's gross. I'd be tempted to throw a glass of ice water on his erection - like you'd do to a dog that was humping somebody's leg. Could you tell him to go beat off in the bathroom - or you just sleep on the couch until he learns to control himself. It was appalling to me, too. Part of me wished I was the only woman going through this - but in a way it's comforting to know this isn't that unusual and I could gain encouragement, strength and hope from others who were growing through this problem. What boundaries are you willing to make? I know it's harder when you don't have your own funds - I'm a housewife, too. But it is do-able... it's just a bit more delicate to figure out how to make boundaries when you don't have an income. Can you join a group for wives of SA/PA? What about counseling with a therapist trained to help families of SA/PA? Have you called your local homeless or women's shelter - they often have a wealth of information on ideas for becoming less dependent on him so you can have more options for you and the children. Sorry you're going through that. It seems so unfair to have had your childhood experience and then escape that for this torture. LookingUp
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kianna
Junior Member
Posts: 62
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Post by kianna on Dec 14, 2007 12:47:18 GMT -5
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Post by mo4wo1 on Dec 14, 2007 13:41:51 GMT -5
notsoserene, Looks really have nothing to do with SA (Sexual Addiction), seriously. As LookingUp already stated, this is about a brain chemical high. It's about poor coping mechanisms and usually past experiences of abuse as a child and/or an addiction transference. I too was a model for a while. I was "the model woman" and by that I mean I had the shape most men claim to prefer. I have since gained weight but, as it turns out, I now have the body type my H actually prefers in every sense. One time when I caught him, he pulled up the pics to show me how much they looked like me. He even said, "See! They look just like you!" Crazy making! He even had 2 "P-GF's" (porn-girl friends, porn pics he especially preferred) for 9 years of the 13 we've been together where one of them looked eerily like me. I mean, literally, put glasses on her & I would have thought I was staring at a long-lost twin! For years, there, he would try to get me to buy certain outfits. I had suspected but I now know he was doing that, asking me to wear certain things, because that was what the P-GF's were wearing. And how twisted is that? To have a wife that you rarely will have sex with, actively fight her to refuse her, yet have a preferred P-pic of a girl that looks just like her (minus glasses) that you will MB to regularly? And I have never refused him in bed, either (one of my boundary issues I am working on). He sounds like a compulsive and/or maybe something of a habitual or ritualistic MB'er. These relationships are abusive & I am sadly not surprised he is abusive in ways other than just sexually. And please have no doubt, that is what is occurring. I have been in several abusive relationships. My parents were abusive to each other & to me. My H & I have been abusive to each other. There can be hope, real hope, but only if they want the change to occur. My H is diligently working his recovery. We still have some very rough spots, there, some others would have left for. But changes are happening... slowly. Has your H admitted to being an SA? Have you researched this much? I'll share with you some of my favorite sites & books. With an education of this topic -- and we really almost all have to be self-taught about this with the way society is -- you will likely experience a few changes in your opinions & beliefs, such as the one that P is okay or that there is a healthy level of P the one can par-take in. I leave that at that, for now. Here's a list of my preferred sites for info & some books on the subject: www.sexhelp.com/*I took the Sexual Addiction Screening Test (SAST) myself and it was very helpful for me. The test & my researching this topic helped me to recognize & accept my own addiction as well as help me understand my H's addiction behaviors better than ever. www.healthyplace.com/Communities/Sex/sexual_addiction/partners.aspwww.recoverynation.com/* One note of caution about this site: It makes lots of noises & sounds when you navigate through it. www.medicinenet.com/sexual_addiction/article.htm"Don't Call It Love" by Patrick Carnes, Ph.D. "Out of the Shadows" by Patrick Carnes, Ph.D. "Not Just Friends" by Shirley Glass and Jean Coppock Staeheli * A member here with an amazing book list of her own recently recommended this. I read it several months ago but not fully. But what I did get from it was helpful & the recent recommendation of it has stirred my interest again. I found mine at my local library. You may have it available to you at yours. I wish you all the best. Mo
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Post by zerotolerance on Dec 14, 2007 15:44:39 GMT -5
There's no amount of "healthy" sexuality being dipicted in p. Using p is NEVER an expression of "healthy" sexuality. There is no safe amount, nor any safe type, nor any safe frequency. It hi-jacks mens natural sexuality (ie brainwashes them when they CHOOSE to use) and it turns em into pornosexuals, instead of hetrosexuals. It doesn't matter who we are, nor what we look like, we're OBJECTIFIED. My h didn't pick his p g/f cause she looked like me, he picked ME because I looked like his g/f imo. I "looked" like a good object, just like she does. But I know words, and he wasn't counting on that! I can think for myself, and he definately wasn't counting on that.
You need to educate yourself until you have every lie that he, or others have spewed into you, eradicated. It's intimidating when we can't explain this stuff, and when they rage. But you don't have to discuss it with him, in order to learn it for yourself. You don't need his permission, nor his blessing, nor for him to even ever understand it himself. You need to work on getting yourself strong enough to take control of you back from him.
You are being abused. And it is affecting your self esteem, which makes it harder for us to see our other options, but not impossible. When he makes those threats about the kids, he does it because it is EFFECTIVE for keeping you in control. Not because he would actually raise two kids by himself. Change ALL your reactions to him to non-emotional reactions, and see then see what happens. My guess is he is viewing you as an object, or an ERRANT object, since you don't react the way he has been taught to expect based on p stupidiy. And that because he is dysfunctional he is using you for emotional narcissistic supply. When they give up their emotions to p, the only emotional contact they have left, comes thru us. My h doesn't care if it is good or bad supply, so long as he could get an emotional reaction, he thinks it means I love him or that I care. AS IF it doesn't mean I'm actually UPSET for a real reason.
You are in a bad place, but if you're home all day with a computer, there is lots of stuff you can learn. Stuff that will, in time, make you strong enough to see that you have the power to control you. It's your right and responsibilty to decide things for yourself. He views you as an extension of him, but you and I, and many others know, that you are individual, not an extension of him, not and object, not HIS possession. It's not up to HIM to decide what you will do, it's up to YOU. But you've been conditioned to give that control over to him, so you are going to have to learn how to take control and responsibilty for yourself first, and then take it back from him! He's not man enough to handle the responsibility of controlling himself, much less you and the kids too. He is a KID, that's what p does to men. It turns em into guys stuck in puberty, immature, objectifiers who spew nothing but the controlling attitudes exsoused, taught, and learned by using p. He's a p projector imo, and you are the screen he trys to play his movies on. But you aren't a screen, nor a mirror for his dysfunction, nor an object of any kind. YOU have to learn this, whether he does or not. And we aren't doing our kids any favors when we raise them in unhealthy situations. The effects this is having on you makes you far less effective as a good parent. That's a problem that YOU can address, but it will take time and effort, and the courage to look beyond what you know now, and out into the TRUTHs of the universe. We don't get to just decide that "porn is harmless", or that it's okay. We can think it all we want to, but that don't make it true. You know it's hurting you, so who are you going to believe? You need to believe what your own soul is showing you, not his doo spew, imo.
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Post by LookingUp on Dec 14, 2007 17:33:11 GMT -5
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Post by notsoserene on Dec 19, 2007 10:34:39 GMT -5
Thank you all for your replies as well as the additional links. I appreciate all of your help. I have done alot of research and was shocked to learn how I have changed all of my behaviors because of his sex addiction. I was quite disturbed to associate my behavior with self destructive or withdrawn behavior. Every one has always asked why I am so quiet and I realize I am scared to be humiliated by yet another one of the rude remarks he might make. demaning and degrading me. What kind of spineless person have I become if I just lay here disgusted while he MB's without even saying a word. Even if I said something once again he would call me crazy. It is just hard to think or feel anything when he is around because he is so disrespectful and tells me that is not how I should feel. When it comes to the P issue or MBion issue he says I am jealous or "crazy". Then sometimes I feel it is my imagination but in my gut I always know whats going on. To make it worse I try to speak to my friend and all she says is every guy in the world does it. I went to sleep with him MBing and I woke up to him MBing in the bathroom. The thought of throwing cold ice water on his erection made me smile and actually laugh out loud. Gotta go
Not So Serene
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kianna
Junior Member
Posts: 62
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Post by kianna on Dec 19, 2007 13:59:11 GMT -5
I used to get this all the time, crazy, paranoid, insane, etc. One day, I just started agreeing when we were in a discussion. He would say "you're crazy" and I would just say "yep" and keep on talking never missing a beat. He finally quit saying those things, when he got no adverse reaction to it.
Don't know if it will work for others, but it seemed to help here.
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Post by zerotolerance on Dec 19, 2007 16:38:17 GMT -5
Telling us what we should think, and how we should feel, is OBJECTIFICATION in action. He doesn't get to decide for you. Women aren't one size fits all OBJECTS. It's not you, and you're not crazy. He is! It's crazy of him to think you should be okay with the way he treats you. It's obvious he's very far removed from any emotions, if he thinks this should feel good, and be okay with you. And as far as your friend, don't talk to her about it, because she's giving you bad advice. All men don't do it, and all who do are pretty messed up imo. Sometimes they aren't dealing with addicts, or their men are better at hiding it , and/or are not compulsively mbng all the time. She hasn't connected the dots back to p/mb yet, but you have been forced into seeing the reality of what p/mb does to a man, and what it robs women of. You don't need anyone else to tell you that you are hurting as a result. Instead of trying to find a way to live with it, or accept it, you have to find new ways to learn to live without tolerating it. You have to give voice to your own pain, and then you will be able to speak it with confidence. We all get intimidated by these men, and we all get taught the same p-promoting lies, but that doesn't make it right. They are still lies, and we are still being manipulated into the false belief of we have to accept it. No we don't. That never, ever worked, for a single one of us. Don't run from the truth, EMBRACE IT, NAME IT, HONOR IT, and live it, and his doo spew will roll right off you. There word games only work when we buy into it. Don't believe his lies. You don't need him to see truth in order for you to heal, you just need to see it, and know it, and honor it for yourself. We don't really have nothing to loose by trying a new a way, esp not when we don't really have anything worth having to begin with. A lying cheating manipulative man is not worth having. It's not love, it's not healthy, and it is not a relationship between a man and a woman. He's in relationship with his HAND, and that SHOULD BE a problem for both of you, but he's too messed up to realize that FACT! Thank God you're not, even though it hurts to know it. It's a blessing. You are being blessed with awareness of the truths that will set you free from your internal prision. The truth will set you free, but first it really pisses us off. You are wonderful, beautiful, person, who deserves far better than you are getting. You have been conditioned to cater to him, to walk eggshells, to tolerate crap without complaint. But you can reprogram yourself back to a healthier view too. He's creating a cycle of "not enough" no matter what you do, so don't play by his rules anymore. We can't win at that stupid game. I changed everything about my behavior, then I just watched my h goes thru his bag of tricks over and over looking for one that would work. He wants emotional reactions from me. But I don't provide those anymore. He wants to manipulate a sense of control, but I refuse to be manipulated anymore. You are far stronger than you think you are, you just need to work on rebuilding you from the inside with the truth. Their doo spew doesn't stand a chance of hurting us anymore when we are full of truth and thus protected by the armor of God.
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Post by realthing on Dec 19, 2007 17:03:00 GMT -5
i was directed to this site today www.moralityinmedia.org/follow link on right hand side 'Effects of Pornography' will get an article entitled: 'What Do The Courts Say? Child Custody, Visitation Rights and Pornography By Robin S. Whitehead Senior Attorney, The National Obscenity Law Center' hope this helps.
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Post by notsoserene on Jan 2, 2008 11:43:37 GMT -5
Thanks again for all your posts. I have taken so much information in lately. It has helped me deal with the emotional pain a little. I went to take a shower and relized I had no hot water and walked out to him watching porn and I sat and talked with him. He told me he thinks about it 24 hours a day and that he cant stop and I tried to tell him he needs help and he said hes done it for 20 years and he cant change. He lies and says he doesnt MB in bed and I told him I wasnt stupid that I can tell when something is going on. I told him not to be embarassed that he has a disease and I wished he would learn to respect me more. Even worse I put the ringtone respect on my cell phone so every time it rings Mrs. Aretha Franklin reminds me that I need to demand some respect from the perv. He reveled alot to me and told me he pays for porn on tv sneaks in and rents movies at the movie store, and he wouldnt admit to the porn on his phone or his favorites on the internet. He has been going to this site called sharing my wife and I am praying he isnt posting images of me there to intice other women. He told me HE IS NOT GOING TO BE CONTROLLED MY BE ANYMORE. And my attitude was I ask you not to look at P and MB that is not controlling I am asking for my sanity and my self respect self esteem and he thinks I control him when he has every dime to so what he wishes with, leaves me with no car and 2 kids, and goes off and does whatever he wants. Is it possible to loose your mind any more? I spoke with him rationally but my mind was reeling with the terrible reality he just put before me. He said it with such a I dont give a 'hoot' attitude. Like he was telling me the grocery list. I felt sick with disgust. I just let him go off blaming me saying it was my fault and my actions that forced him into it (even though he has been doing this since long before I met him) I asked him of previous girlfriends and if that is the reason they left him (because of the P) and he said yeah probably...they left me to go with other people because they probably couldnt put up with it. ....his attitude is all women are whores...all women cheat...all women lie and that we live to hurt men pretty much. I explained to him that all women arent like they are in P...you cant go to the library and get the librarian like you do in the movies (librarian was the only reference that came to mind). I told him he has a problem and how do I know when he might not be able to control it. I told him he has anger issues and sexual addiction issues and that the two combined is awful. That people go to jail and he said in my mind it doesnt work that way he wouldnt hurt someone to satisfy himself. I just know he is able to have sex with me while I am sleeping after taking 2 tylenol PM and am out cold so whats gonna keep him from doing it to someone else. Tylenol PM is the only way I manage to sleep anymore. The holidays were hard to make it through. He was actually telling me how to eat the other day. I looked up with a very mean look and said are you actually telling me how to eat and the smug jerk said 'Yeah'. You know its bad when they tell you how to eat. To make it worse my older brother passed away a few years ago on december 22nd and it was hard to make it through that day again and then January 1st is his birthday and it was way harder to cope with this year than before. I have alot of things going on at once and it is hard to be strong. Thanks again for all of your advice. At least, since he cant deal with his problem, I can understand it a little better and make changes on my part. Happy New Year.
Not So Serene
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