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Post by completelydone on Dec 1, 2007 20:58:07 GMT -5
www.pureintimacy.org/gr/intimacy/information/a0000177.cfm You know, I hear a lot of people say porn addiction is a men's problem. Really it's an intimacy disorder. So, realizing that, it makes sense why men more often are involved with porn than women (even though 1 in 4 dollars spent on porn is spent by women), because men are taught to not be emotional because it is weakness. Women are usually (I was not and I was a porn addict), taught or at least allowed to be/express their emotional selves. Therefore women seek out the intimacy that every person needs and craves (including men but they don't like to admit it), while many men are too fearful to be intimate with anyone because it would make them less of a man. Because it is an intimacy disorder, it is important to get individual and marital counseling: Please read this article ladies, it will help you understand "why". Below is just a few suggestions on chosing a counselor from the article, but it is not the part of the article that speaks about the "why" of sex addictions. Avoid: Avoid:
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Post by completelydone on Dec 1, 2007 21:34:22 GMT -5
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Post by completelydone on Dec 3, 2007 19:46:57 GMT -5
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facingit
Full Member
One day at a time
Posts: 111
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Post by facingit on Dec 3, 2007 22:32:48 GMT -5
Post deleted.
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Post by dazednconfused on Dec 3, 2007 23:11:04 GMT -5
facingit.. you might want to hang in the general forum or in the ra section for a while... it is a very daring person who comes and posts in the so's section without a load of recovery time under their belts.
There are many statements in your above post that many will say "drip with addict speak".. just warning you it might get a little hot in the kitchen.
It's not name calling... and the articles are not meant to give guilt.. they are a way for us to understand how to help our husband/significant other. Would you prefer "intimacy disabled" or better yet "intimacy retarded" oooooh, how about "intimacy delayed" Because like it or not, prn, and many times those factors in your life that lead to prn addiction are ABSOLUTELY based in damage to your ability to be truly intimate.
Intimacy is not only sexual. And ALL ADDICTIONS are based in an inability to be intimate. Prn addiction just attacks that in a different (and many would argue more painful) way.
Our SA trained marriage counselor had us focus on only one thing: rebuilding intimacy. Seriously, one thing. He sad blowing up that wall between any person with an addiction and thier loved one is the most effective way to overcome this and any other addiction. It's worked so far in the past 20 months. As you said in another thread "direction not perfection"
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Post by Disillusioned on Dec 4, 2007 7:15:42 GMT -5
I agree with CD here - facingit, you are a new member here and almost all of your posts are to SOs in the SO forum. This area is for SO's who have been hurt by their partners p use to find support. You would probably be better served if you were to work on your own recovery on the addicts side (or the General side if you wish to hear SO views as well)
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Post by hurtandlonely on Dec 4, 2007 9:33:14 GMT -5
I would be very careful here. By using all caps to emphasize your point, you are being antagonistic to women who are trying to come to grips with what their PA partner has done to them. You sound like someone who is using a great deal of sugarcoated doublespeak to insulate those awful behaviors you guys like to protect so much. I suggest keeping your posts focused on yourself. Just FYI - my violently alcoholic father also has "a problem with the terminology" of addiction. The truth hurts, and quibbling over the words used to describe it is just another way to avoid taking responsibility for your recovery. You know, I have a bit of a problem with this terminology. For example, I have a very intimate relationship with my SO, she knows I use porn and, while it doesn't turn her on, it doesn't bother her. I think PA can definitely create intimacy problems in a relationship - if it comes between the two partners - but it doesn't AUTOMATICALLY do this. Also, calling it an intimacy disorder runs the risk of making addicts feel more "broken" than they are - I AM NOT MY ADDICTION. Can alcoholism cause intimacy problems? Sure. Does being an alcoholic mean you are incapable of having an intimate relationship? Well I hope not or else most of our parents would be out!! I am not trying to say porn helps relationships, not by any stretch of the imagination. I'm just saying that if we want a concrete result (stopping porn use) we need useful analysis and I don't see how labelling porn as an intimacy disorder is going to help any PA's recover. What many SO's don't seem to understand (and understandably so) is that a PA CANNOT BE GUILTED BETTER. I think labelling PA an "intimacy disorder" is an veiled attempt at the old "If you really loved me you'd stop," arguement. I, for one, think that is a load of BS. It's about as effective as walking up to a heroin addict and saying, if you loved me you would stop. I don't think PA necessarily indicates an intimacy disorder. It might be more accurate to say that it sometimes causes a lack of desire/ ability to be intimate on the part of the SO. So, unless you want to be labelled with an "Intimacy reaction disorder".... and how useful would that label be? It sounds a lot like name-calling to me. |
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Post by ferdberfil on Dec 4, 2007 12:04:04 GMT -5
I definitely think my PA is an "intimacy disorder," and aside from the religious element in CD's post (my wife and I are both atheists), I agree with it 100%.
-FB
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Post by ellen38 on Dec 4, 2007 12:24:08 GMT -5
this has been a very important realization for me.
it helped me tremendously, and I think it doesn't hurt to be reminded of this from time to time.
I do have to agree with the others however about coming to this side.
ellen
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Post by ellen38 on Dec 4, 2007 12:30:06 GMT -5
oh and the actual topic of the thread...it's true.
my H's therapist told me the same thing. The fact that H has/will have trouble being intimate with me because of his disability/retardation/delay (hee hee Dazed) scared me more than his p habit. If I can separate myself and say his p habit has nothing to do with me, I cannot seem to do that when it comes to our interaction as a couple. That is ALL about me and him.
ellen
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Post by witness on Dec 4, 2007 12:33:02 GMT -5
Along this line I found Schaumburg's book, "False Intimacy" to be very good and quite insightful.
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Post by completelydone on Dec 4, 2007 13:36:50 GMT -5
You know, I have a bit of a problem with this terminology. For example, I have a very intimate relationship with my SO, she knows I use porn and, while it doesn't turn her on, it doesn't bother her. I think PA can definitely create intimacy problems in a relationship - if it comes between the two partners - but it doesn't AUTOMATICALLY do this. Also, calling it an intimacy disorder runs the risk of making addicts feel more "broken" than they are - I AM NOT MY ADDICTION. Can alcoholism cause intimacy problems? Sure. Does being an alcoholic mean you are incapable of having an intimate relationship? Well I hope not or else most of our parents would be out!! I am not trying to say porn helps relationships, not by any stretch of the imagination. I'm just saying that if we want a concrete result (stopping porn use) we need useful analysis and I don't see how labeling porn as an intimacy disorder is going to help any PA's recover. What many SO's don't seem to understand (and understandably so) is that a PA CANNOT BE GUILTED BETTER. I think labeling PA an "intimacy disorder" is an veiled attempt at the old "If you really loved me you'd stop," argument. I, for one, think that is a load of BS. It's about as effective as walking up to a heroin addict and saying, if you loved me you would stop. I don't think PA necessarily indicates an intimacy disorder. It might be more accurate to say that it sometimes causes a lack of desire/ ability to be intimate on the part of the SO. So, unless you want to be labeled with an "Intimacy reaction disorder".... and how useful would that label be? It sounds a lot like name-calling to me. Hello facingit, I can see that you haven't been here long, so we don't really know each other yet. I can also see by your name that you are wanting to face your problems and deal with them. However, as many porn addicts do in the beginning, you think attacking your behavior will solve your porn addiction....... maybe, learning to control your "manliness" is what you think you need to do. But, the fact of the matter is that people who are addicts, especially and specifically porn addicts are seeking a false intimacy in the place of real, genuine, emotional intimacy. Real good sex can only follow real good emotional intimacy. I am not calling you names, or labeling you. I am talking about, educating, helping people understand that roots of this horrid addiction that destroys the user, the SO's, the family, and society. If I called you names, I would also have to call myself names, being that I used to be a PA and am 10 years free. I also used to have an intimacy disorder; which is just a label that explains a problem. That problem is not being comfortable in your own skin, with your own emotions, or anyone else's. My husband is now also clean from porn for 3 1/2 years now, and if he came to this board, he would tell you what I am right now, but probably a lot more straight to the point. So, I hope you are open to learning a few things, or else you are wasting your time trying to heal. You cannot just WILL your behavior away, it takes a commitment to stop, but also to heal the roots of the tree. Intimacy disorder is one those roots; one of the biggest. Take care, CD Witness, I've thought about buying that book. Is it worth paying for? |
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facingit
Full Member
One day at a time
Posts: 111
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Post by facingit on Dec 4, 2007 17:05:27 GMT -5
Sorry. I was out of line. I aplogize.
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Post by justme123 on Dec 4, 2007 18:42:20 GMT -5
I was told that by my counselor a few years ago, that the reason my husband was addicted to P was because of his fear of intimacy. Now years later, I find I am too. Because when we have sex now I can't help but fear that he isn't really present with me... I find myself questioning all the time if it is really getting better. I want to believe it but it seems like when I trust it is better I get hurt again.
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Post by zerotolerance on Dec 4, 2007 20:27:43 GMT -5
I view as an intimacy disorder too.
And a spiritual disorder.
And a mental disorder.
And an emotional disorder.
And an blantant immaturity.
And a soul hole disorder.
And a body/mind conditioning disorder.
And EVERYTHING about it is TOTALLY DISORDERED.
Our souls go where we go, only user disconnect theirs while p-ng imo. But it's still there, it's still being damaged. They are soo wrongly emotionally connected to p that the very idea of connecting with any ONE else is a martian concept for many. P hijacks their hearts, minds, bodies, and souls. Period. We don't get to decide that it don't, won't, can't. Well we can decide whatever we like, but the truth will still be the truth, and one day we find oursleves having to face it. Like it or not, no matter what we thought.
Everything is connected to everything. When one suffers, we ALL suffer.
What they call intimacy, is just p sex, not intimacy. NO USER is ever truly present with his spouse in the way intimacy is designed to be experienced imo. You can't have both p, and true intimacy. You can't manipulate with lies, and call it intimacy. If my h had said he p'd, then I wouldn't have been with him. But only because he lied I was. Now he might call that "our intimacy" but there really wasn't nothing intimate about it. I was a mere manipulation into a fake sense of intimacy, or some p reenactment for him. We can't bring our souls when they are trapped away behind all the compartmental lie walls. And without out hearts, minds, bodies, and SOULS being present and fully informed, there's no intimacy whatsoever. That's just another lie on top of the gigantic pile of other p lies.
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