To all PA's - Neil "its normal"

[truthorlie]

Something for all PA's to consider - Neil's post

i am not addicted to P, i MB just as much without it.

To the PA: Do you feel this way about yourself. Fine, prove your SO wrong, whether you choose to MB or not, give up P for one year. Go ahead, do it. Don't think its the P that causes you to MB, fine - give it up for one year.

i have a high sex drive much higher than my wife and felt that rather than constantly nag her and pester her to have sex with me, i chose to use MB to relieve my sexual fustration, and also to know that when we did make love it was not because she had given in to my demands to shut me up, but because she wanted too.

To PA's: Think this sounds like your situation. Thought it/said it out loud a couple hundred times? Ask your SO if she could have any number of sexual situations/orgasms any given week, what would that number be? Without any pressures of performing (yeah, guys think they need to perform! Well, the women do to! We have a lot more to compete against for your attention than you do for ours! in general.) Without any pain or embarrassment or low self-esteem or fear or etc. - ask her how many times a week she would want some wonderful sex. You'd be surprised to hear her answer, I bet, that is as long as she is willing to speak to you on this subject right now as if you are a PA, she has probably lost all her trust in you, which means she has lost the desire to be intimate (emotional and physical) with you - she has most likely built up some sort of barrier to keep the majority of pain and hurt out. But again, I bet you be REALLY surprised at her answer. Her number? Probably higher than yours.

My wife feels that i was unfaithful to her because i sometimes used pictures and videos of other women during my MB. i completely understand this and feel bad about hurting her feelings

To PA's: How long could you go without getting angry, jealous, sad, hurt and seriously want to leave your wife if tonite you discovered that she was viewing P and MB for YEARS as you have done yourself. I put a pic of a VERY NAKED, VERY HOT GUY on the computer as a screen saver to make a point when exH and I were trying to reconcile. Know what? He pretended he didn't give a damn. Know what else? He later told me (rather angrily and violently) to fkn' remove it and NOW! Seems as though it WAS a big deal to him. How many of you PA's out there are telling yourselves and others the lie that it wouldn't phase you at all if your wife was doing what you are doing?

I don't know much about this "neil" guy (obviously), but I will tell you, God shows us great examples as in "In Your Face, Right Here" types of examples every so often.... I think this is one of them.

One more note: if neil doesn't think he has a problem, why did he post on this board?

[truthorlie]

Neil is the husband of an SO posting on this board.

[realthing]

yeah - iwent to reply to his post and saw it was banned - no idea why. but anyway i did relate to him 'cos my h is more of a casual user (well that's what he admits to ). but this is a big issue for me 'cos although i totally relate to the other pa so's here i (thankfully) don't have the additional probs of the frequency of the p use and also the really weird p that some of them have to deal with - but on the otherhand neither do i have the explanation that the tag addict provides. so why then if not an addict did my h continue his p use knowing full well that it would result in the end of our marriage (we already split for 7 months because of it)? i can't get it out of my head - i'm like so you're not addicted so why the (expletive) did you not stop, why the (expletive) did you continue despite knowing my feelings on it , the hurt and the ultimate destruction it would cause. so i'm left thinking he really just didn't give a toss about me. there is something definitely not quite right to me - simple if you're not addicted just stop then!

i thought from neils post that although his wife may have a religious basis to her beliefs about mb - that they are not set in stone - that he can talk to her about them. i'm suspecting that if her religion dictates that mb is bad then it also predicts that sexual intercourse is not an end in itself but rather a means to procreation - so she doesn't use (or never used) birth control neil? i think you will find she is more concerned with the fact that you fantasize about shagging other women whilst mb'ing to p - that is a type of infidelity in my book also. in any case if he did find that her objections to mb were solely and immovably rooted in religion - then well you should respect her religious beliefs - i'm pretty sure you knew what religion she was when you married her. this is wot get's me if you's guys want p then why don't you go out and have relationships with like minded women and (expletive)in' leave the rest of us alone - never mind stepping into our lives and (expletive)in' it up with your own crap view of what sexuality is.

truthorlie - i am repeating myself here but in the 5 months prior to separating from my h we had no sex at all (not going into detail ) - during that 5 months i mb every night using fantasy revolved around a guy i had met some years ago. (i did this to reep some sort of psychological revenge on my h even although he at the time had no clue- crazy eh?) when we split i told him this and when it finally sank into him that 'hey no i'm not kidding' - it gave him a wake up call to how that feels to have your so cheat on you in this way (well at least he has told me since that he can't get that out of his head - hey welcome to my world you prick).

if i had replied to neils post directly it would have been a lot less bitter - i had just wanted to say to the guy that he should talk to his wife, and respect her a bit more.

[cleverusername]

I have been lurking on this board awhile, trying to determine the extent of my problem (or, frankly, whether it is a "problem" at all). I have been grateful to have a place to explore this subject, and to have a ready (and effective) alternative on those occasions when I consider looking at online porn.

I read Neil's original post, and was interested to read a number of the responses. There was one, from a member aptly named zerotolerance, who declared, among other things, that MB is never normal for adults. This person seemed to base his reasoning on his or her religious beliefs.

I've seen other, similar posts that suggest husbands are generally responsible for their wives' self-esteem and feelings of security, and that any mismatch in partners' sex drives (evidently a frequent canard when it comes to rationalizing porn use) is likely a function of some brand of sex addiction.

Is this the prevailing point of view here, or just one of many? It would be helpful for me to know before I decide whether this board is the right place for me.

Thank you.

[cammy]

I don't have much time but I've been given a favour today so will try to give one back. 1) This board has had a number of trolls recently that grazed on the topic your are addressing so if you get a hot response consider history. 2) For people addicted to porn, like booze or smack, they lie cheat and steal to get their substance. This impacts the self-esteem of the partner. Not only are they looking at highly charged images and lying about it, they are also often mbing while doing so. This leaves, at least, a sense of betrayal. I am one who has done this and done it while my wife was pregnant. 3) While I agree that people will pursue their sex drives with differing frequencies, satisfying a higher drive outside of an existing committed relationship is really not on. It is a rationalization that using porn to do so is not impactful. In fact, it is impactful and can hurt quite a lot. I encourage you to read the SO forum (suggest you do not post) to get a more global impact of the effect.

I will tell you that I do not necessarily agree with all positions taken here. And you don't have to. You can seek your own benefit if you believe there is any to be found. BTW, Neil thought that there was. If you look at porn and lie about it, especially to your wife/husband, I humbly submit that you have a problem. Maybe not an addiction to porn, but a problem. If you look at porn and cannot refrain in spite of better judgement then you're an addict as far as I am concerned.

If you'd like some help, please stay. If not, thanks for coming by.

[cleverusername]

Cammy, many thanks for taking the time to share these thoughts with me.

[alyson]

Cammy,I am neils wife. I dont know your story. What I can say is that in comparison to others here, my H problem is not as serious in some ways. My H is a sex addict, possibly a P addict that doest know it yet.
If you have a wife, or SO in my opinion you are hurting her. I dont know what your issues are but you are on this forum for a reason like the rest of us. My H Neil, still hasnt fully come to a place where he can see the extent of his addiction.It was only exposed to me on sunday. He is not sure this is the right place for him too. I think he may still be looking for somewhere to tell him he is normal and his behaviour is ok. Let me tell you that as a wife watching a husband she adores, any sex outwith my bedroom with me, is infidelity. When he looks at other women naked and whatever they may be doing, he IS having a REAL sexual experience with them. I dont know if it is more or less difficult for me because Neil is not a christian, but I wish he did have God to help him. I feel like a floundering fish fighting for breath. Im really pleased you are here because you obviously think something is wrong. If you are thinking that , IT IS. No matter how small or insignificant you may think your issue is, the fact that you are here shows something is wrong. As a wife , I beg you to stay and fix your life because your life has a fantastic plan and you are the centre of that plan. God bless you cammie

[cammy]

Hi Alyson,
If you would like to know my story I have a journal you are welcome to read. I apologise but your post confused me.

[jonas612]

Hey clever:

While there are a number of varying strong personalities on this board, I think if you come in with an open mind and discard the more judgmental, you will find this is a great wealth of knowledge.

Some posters here believe that 'tough love' or, blatant, blunt honesty/scaring someone straight is the way to go here. Others take a more compassionate approach. Either way, I'm pretty sure you're going to find what you need.

I think, personally, a large part of recovery is having the ability to discuss your possible issues in an open forum, and the varied reactions that you get will not only help you when you find the one that you empathize with, but will give you ideas of how other people in your life may view the problem you may have.

I, too, was first taken aback by some of the stronger voices here, until I looked at it as them just trying to help.

There are also other trollers, as well, but as cammy said, consider history.

good luck and I hope you find what you need.
-ed

[alyson]

Hi , I will read your post. Im sorry if ive been clueless and dived in presuming:)