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Post by megan11 on Dec 7, 2007 18:15:31 GMT -5
For those with an SO, how long did it take for you to stop acting out with your partner while being intimate with her? I mean, how long can the images of P and thoughts of P last while being intimate? My H claims that he has been P/MB free for the past 11 months but he is still acting out with me while we are intimate, and acting out to the extreme. This makes me question his honesty about the P/MB. Any answers are very much appreciated. Thank you..
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Post by 1dayatatime on Dec 7, 2007 19:14:26 GMT -5
For those with an SO, how long did it take for you to stop acting out with your partner while being intimate with her? I mean, how long can the images of P and thoughts of P last while being intimate? My H claims that he has been P/MB free for the past 11 months but he is still acting out with me while we are intimate, and acting out to the extreme. This makes me question his honesty about the P/MB. Any answers are very much appreciated. Thank you.. I don't understand how you can say that he "claims" to be Mb/P free and is still "acting out" with you. That is contradictory. What do you define as "acting out" with you? I'm guessing that you suspect that he is fantasizing while being intimate with you. But it isn't clear.
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Post by megan11 on Dec 7, 2007 19:21:45 GMT -5
I dont want to add any triggers, that is why i am being very evasive. He is saying things to me while we are intimate that some would "think" while MB to porn. (as in calling me dirty things)
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Post by tiger1m on Dec 7, 2007 19:47:38 GMT -5
member megan11 has been advised that additional detail would be helpful in providing an framework for PAs to answer her question. This thread is being closely monitored and PAs are advised to be respectful as are all board members.
Triggering content may be posted. PAs should carefully evaluate their current recovery status before dealing with this important topic.
tiger
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Post by unico on Dec 7, 2007 20:46:04 GMT -5
hi Megan11
With the limited information you supply I can only offer the following advice. If you find what your partner is saying offensive, i.e. you are in no way aroused by his dirty talk, then ask him to stop. If he continues despite your objections then you have cause for concern. You may not have any control over his 'head space' i.e. sexual fantasies, but you have every right to object strongly if his 'talk' disgusts you.
take care
unico
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Post by megan11 on Dec 7, 2007 21:29:39 GMT -5
Ok, i am going to try to put this the least triggering way i can with providing additional detail. I am finding it hard though... [trigger]My H has told me that he has been MB/P free since he got caught 11 months ago. his P/MB issues have been since before we met, he is seeing a therapist and is now on Prozac. We have been married for almost 12 years, together 16. He is 36 I am 31. Ok, now that i wrote a whole lot of nothing because i am STILL trying to put this in a non triggering way here i go. I feel that he is fantasizng while "with me" in bed because of last night. I have been having this feeling because of past times. Examples...Him closing eyes, not looking at me, looking up, sideways anyway but at me, and because he will use names while with me like i am his little s--t, Wh--e, Dirty B-tch and so on. Well 2 nights ago we were "together" no issues and the same as above applied. Last night he has done issues and i believe it was because i made him say my name a few times while we were together. He was having issues in the finishing department and it seems that things would "pick up" if he said the above things to me in between saying my name. Finally i didnt make him say my name anymore, he continued using the other words and had no issues finishing quickly using those names/words. Sooooooooooooo, my question is, if its been a year since MB or watching P, wouldnt those things be out of his head by now? And if he is still doing this with me, would that mean that he is still MB/P? This is hard for me to ask this in here because i do not want to trigger anyone, but at the same time, i need to ask someone who can possible give me some insight. I have been playing ping pong with my life with him for a while now. Honestly, i dont have any way of telling if he is MB on my own. I guess its just something that i never learned so i cant tell that way, and after alot of years of him lying and sneaking, i cant trust HIM to answer this for me. that is why i come to you guys here.[/trigger]I am going to trigger this posting and if any of the mods feel it too triggering PLEASE FEEL FREE TO MODERATE AND EDIT MY POST WITH A BETTER WAY OF WORDING. Thank you all!
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Post by breakingfree on Dec 7, 2007 21:44:46 GMT -5
Megan,
I have learned not to look under those trigger thingies. But being a recovering PA and based upon your earlier comments I have a pretty good idea.
First let me say IMO, it's not appropriate for me to comment on the state of another's sobriety.
I will comment on the appropriateness of "acting out" whilst intimate. Shaky grounds at best. I know how easy it would be for me to bring back all those images and and say(for us) inappropriate things while being intimate. It would endanger my sobriety and screw up a relationship, an intimacy reborn that I have been working very hard to fix.
bf
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Post by tiger1m on Dec 7, 2007 21:53:23 GMT -5
I personally find the question difficult to tackle. This area is painful and complex for us addicts. I have dealt with this in my recovery. I encourage recovering addicts to examine this serious intimacy issue in their relationship.
In the spirit of that I will break from normal moderating and answer.
It is commonly reported and has been my experience that we porn addicts will use our partners as a convenient masturbation tool. By this I mean that rather than emotional and physical intimacy I had a head full of pornography while having physical relations.
This presented problems for both of us. I cannot assure you at what point I became aware that this was what was happening. As difficult as it may seem we addicts become accustomed to elements of our addiction and lose the normal awareness of them that non-addicts retain.
I learned that this kind of behavioral acting out damaged both of us. It became a goal of my recovery to restore the physical and emotion connection I had robbed from us.
My partner is not a tool for me to masturbate with. I no longer use pornography and I do not use it in the marriage bed. How long it takes is a matter of individual addiction and recovery. We currently enjoy a mutually satisfactory level of physical and emotional intimacy.
member megan11, thank you for asking. I feel any answer will be woefully inadequate for you and for us as well. This addiction is truly baffling.
tiger
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Post by megan11 on Dec 7, 2007 22:04:59 GMT -5
Tiger your really seemed to hit the nail on the head with your example of your partner not being a tool for you to masturbate with. That is how i have been feeling, i guess i just didnt know how to put it. Thanks Tiger for posting!! I dont feel that any answer about this situation here would be inadequate at all to me because i am just in need of some honest insight in the matter. It is baffling to both parties i believe but i know with those who come here and post here, they will help me because they dont have anything to lose by doing so. My H on the other hand does have a few things to lose by answering honestly, after all thats where our whole issues began if you think about it. I really, really appreciate all of your advice. I honestly do not have anyone else to ask about these things (except the partners forum and they are great) but i am in need of some advice from the side my H is on as well as the support of my fellow partners. Just so you all know, i really do cheer you all on everyday and i wish you all well, that is why i did have such a hard time posting my issue in here. It is triggering imo and i woudnt want to do that to anyone here.
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facingit
Full Member
One day at a time
Posts: 111
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Post by facingit on Dec 8, 2007 12:29:58 GMT -5
I dont want to add any triggers, that is why i am being very evasive. He is saying things to me while we are intimate that some would "think" while MB to porn. (as in calling me dirty things) Hey meghan, From my point of view it sounds like you may be dealing with two seperate issues. I used P for many years and never "acted out" during sex the way you say your husband does. I do not believe P can "make" people act out in that way. Like I said, it sounds like your H may have 2 seperate issues - his PA and how he talks to/ treats you. The two may be related, but I don't think staying sober from P will solve the second issue. It sounds like you may need marital conseling to me (although that is a lay opinion).
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Max
New Member
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Post by Max on Dec 8, 2007 13:37:49 GMT -5
Megan11, I read your full hidden post and it is a difficult situation to fully break-down, although I'd like to offer one positive possibility; one that theorizes that your H is not using P at all.
Tangent - My background: I am 36 and have been married to a 36 year old for 13 years, together for 16. P used to be something my wife and I occasionally enjoyed together, but it eventually became an issue for me, and has now been something I have been struggling with for about 6 years. (She discovered that it was an issue one year ago. I've made great strides this past year as I have been, by comparison of the previous 5 years, prertty much P free the last 1. My head is in a totally different and better place.)
Anyway, I understand your concerns and I by no means can tell you that your H is not using P, however, I think you can also consider that his recent intimate behavior could indicate he is actually feeling very comfortable with himself and you, that he's moved on from his addiction.
Now, I didn't feel that Megan11's trigger portion was very triggering to me, but in order to address it, I feel I better do the same for the next part.
[trigger] When I was at my worst with P, intimacy was a slightly guilty experience for me. I *did* have P-graphic images in my head and I felt that to be incredibly unfair to my wife. But, at the same time, if she were to bring in dirty talk or something like this, I hesitated because I was worried that somehow my enthusiasm would tell her, "ah ha! see how adept at this sort of behavior I am? I clearly must be a real sicko!"
However, once I pulled my brain out of the gutter, intimate situations became freer for me. I feel like I can be anything and do anything with her and it's okay. I'm no longer self-conscious of revealing ulterior behavior because there isn't any.
As for the closing of the eyes, looking away, etc., I do that too sometimes, as looking at her brings things to an end too soon. Which is exactly the opposite of fantasizing about someone else. [/trigger]
Now, this all may all seem like a contradiction, but it is along the lines from where I am coming from. I certainly cannot say that this applies to your H in any way, however, I felt compelled to give you one possible situation, as it seems like it could fit.
You are right to question his behavior, as per his history, but....yeah. A little tough. But it sounds like you are getting some interesting feedback here and that's great!
_Max
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Post by unico on Dec 8, 2007 16:45:18 GMT -5
I am addicted to pornography but I never used my ex-partner 'as a convenient masturbation tool' nor did I have 'a head full of pornography' during intercourse. I just have to challenge the assumption i.e. 'commonly reported' (meaning many) as I am getting tired of being lumped into the generalised cesspit called 'addict'. It seems if you repeat something enough times here is becomes accepted wisdom. To use another example I have been repeatedly warned that MB will innevitably lead me back to porn use. It doesn't. We addicts arrived at our porn addiction from a number of pathes, and departure from porn use is not limited to one path only. What works for me may not work for you. To return to the theme of masturbation tool, does it help to fuel the flames of doubt in an s/o every time they engage in intercourse, always questioning 'is he thinking of me?' If you have any doubts, Ask, if you get a shifty response you have your answer. Otherwise lay down any boundaries you may have, and learn to trust again, because to proceed any other way makes 'Tools' of all of us.
unico
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Post by megan11 on Dec 8, 2007 17:50:43 GMT -5
Dear friends. I want to thank you all again for your posts. I have gain much insight with all the different prespectives and that is what i was looking for. I do know that not everyone is the same, as well as not everyone follows the same paths and knowing this is very good for me because it DOES give me other ways of looking at the situations that i have been going through with my H. Our life has been no doubt, very rough. Trust is very hard for me and i know it will take a very long time to believe his words again. Not saying that i dont miss the trust that is used to have for him, and want the trust returned to me because i think all SO's would love nothing more than to feel they way they used too. My H is a tough one lately. I do remember someone here telling me about Prozac and some possible anger issues that may go along with it and he was right on! After a whole night, ending at 6:30am this morning of arguing and being told to pack my crap and our kids and get out, he didnt care, when i told him i would he caved and told me that its just easier to be angry for him, and easier if he just makes me angry for him. Anger is an easy emotion and easier to deal with than the guilt he has. As far as the using me like a tool, he did mention that i was the one who started the name calling in bed, and to be honest i may have been (thinking thats what he likes) and it just stuck. I really dont remember but again it is a strong possibility. He also mentioned that with all the times i have asked him if he is "with me" when we are intimate, when making him say my name he got spooked, thinking i was thinking he wasnt there with me. I can see that too. He did attend an SAA meeting this morning and gained alot of insight there. He left there with the honest words of the other members, and seeing much more of what he has to lose, because of the losses that the other men have shared plus ways to deal. I had to remind him how everything has been handed to him from me. Therapist (marraige councellor who only sees my H, out of 7 appt, i attended the first 2) Books, Saa meetings, websites, and he has been put on Prozac. Me on the other hand, all i have is what i have been waiting for, My husband to SHOW ME that he wants to do for himself AND me. The only one i have is this board and the wish that he can do the things that he is suposed to do to help himself. If he cant help himself, he cant help me. I need the one who hurt me to make me better, thats his work to do and i honestly cant wait forever for it. So, after a long night my saga will continue because i am still here. I do feel a little bit better about this now and i hope that my friends here will continue to give me their different views to something that is so very hard for all of us. I really appreciate your help and i thank you again. You all have my best wishes. Megan11
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Post by breakingfree on Dec 8, 2007 19:54:45 GMT -5
Megan, My heartfelt wish that there will be a good resolution of your problems. Keep coming here, keep asking questions of your husband, of the board. And let me share my favorite AA saying that helps me keep my head screwed on straight: ONE DAY AT A TIME BF
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Post by TH on Dec 9, 2007 8:56:56 GMT -5
Hi Megan,
In my opinion, being intimate with someone is a two way street. Making love is a mutual act that both parties should enjoy. If he is calling you names and you let him know that you don't like it then it's something that should be stopped immediately. The fact that he's turning the blame back on you for saying that you started it by asking him to say those things is a red flag.
I don't know if he's stopped MB to P. It's not for me to call someone on their sobriety. In my own experience though after really being clean from MB and P it was easy to be in the moment with my wife and not have to resort to images in my head.
I'm wondering if the 2 of you would benefit from a period of abstinence. Maybe 2 weeks to a month. Something I learned in my SA meetings is that sex is optional in life. Like fasting from food for a period, fasting from sex allows one to see what role sex plays in your life. Is it something you resort to as a drug or is it something that brings you closer as a couple in a more intimate way?
It's great that he attended an SAA meeting. If you can work through this it will be so rewarding.
Peace
Th
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